Grandorgue & Windows 7 64 bit

[7thGalaxy]

When you say compression do you mean compress cache? I have now, I'll let you know tomorrow how it goes when I have some time to test thoroughly.

I have been using Windows Directsound: primary sound driver which seems to be stable.

Settings are the same as yours. I'll test again tomorrow. as I said, it was working if you specified a channel but not working if you told it to look for any channel. To set it up, I had it listen for the event I wanted, then changed the channel to any channel.

It is possible that the co-ordinate problem was caused by moving into fullscreen - fullscreen doesn't seem to work very well, as it locks GO to the right of the screen which is unusual.

Btw, the bug with the stiersmockers organ has gone away without me doing anything at all. I'll try to get it to happen again!

[astazou]

I can't really test the 32 bit version, as it won't communicate with Sibelius 7!

Try using loopMidi (www.tobias-erichsen.de/loopMIDI.html)
I use it with GO (0.3.0.3) 32 bit on seven x64 to connect to MidiSwing

[e9925248]

When you say compression do you mean compress cache? I have now, I'll let you know tomorrow how it goes when I have some time to test thoroughly.

No, I mean lossless compression.

The cache compression can only have an effect on the load time from the cache.
The setting itself only affects the next update cache operations - existing cache files are used as they were created. On Windows, you must test yourself, what option
works the best for your setting.

I have been using Windows Directsound: primary sound driver which seems to be stable.

Fine. This is the new portaudio Direct Sound backend.
Feedback about problematic drivers is also welcome.

Settings are the same as yours. I'll test again tomorrow. as I said, it was working if you specified a channel but not working if you told it to look for any channel. To set it up, I had it listen for the event I wanted, then changed the channel to any channel.

Did you change the device filter also to any - otherwise only events from one MIDI interface will be matched.

It is possible that the co-ordinate problem was caused by moving into fullscreen - fullscreen doesn't seem to work very well, as it locks GO to the right of the screen which is unusual.

Btw, the bug with the stiersmockers organ has gone away without me doing anything at all. I'll try to get it to happen again!

Fullscreen is not supported, each window has a maximum allowed size - its an bug, that the fullscreen button works.

[7thGalaxy]

Ok, testing completed. I can confirm that GO dosn't listen on ANY channels if the "any channel" option is selected. Here is how I tested:

I have a manual soundset for sibelius 7 set up. the SW is on channel 2, the pedal is on channel 5. I set up a stop selection, 3 stops on the swell, 1 on the ped. I told the ped stops to listen out for channel 5, and the sw stops to listen out for channel 2. I input the stops changes into sibelius using ~C<stop number assigned to it>,1 . The swell stops I put on the SW stave, therefore they are sent on the same channel as the SW. I did the same for the ped stop, attaching it to the ped, so it is broadcast on channel 5

First test - all of the stops are selected as they should be, at the point I desired.

I then changed 2 of the stops to listen on any channel. And ran the test again. The stops told to listen for a particular channel turned on as desired, the stops listening for "any channel" didn't select anything.

I've also noticed some strange behaviour - for example, in the same score, I have my Tierce set on Data 33, and a Cymbol at 32. So in the score I have ~C33,1 to activate the Tierce, which works fine. However, ~C32,1 dosn't do anything, even if I add it to the same message ( so ~C33,1 C35,1 C37,1 C32,1) All of them except for the Cymbol will get activated!

Another bit of strange behaviour - the SW sub octave activates without any message to activate it.

Hope that's helpful.

Tom

[7thGalaxy]

Oh, and I'm still getting lots of nasty crackling noises on the Burea organ, not even with lots of stops working at once.

[7thGalaxy]

Would anyone be interested in the soundset & preferences files I've created to get Sibelius to be able to output on different channels depending on which manual you specify? (you can change from gt to sw by using an instrument change)

If so, let me know and I'll tidy them up and email them.

Tom

[7thGalaxy]

Found a big bug in GO.

I selected an audio driver (can't remember which one!) for GO to use, and it instantly crashed, with a message from microsoft visual C++ Runtime library saying "This application has requested the Runtime to terminate it in an unusual way, please contact the application's support team for more information"

It then CTDed. When I opened it again, it instantly crashed in the same way. I reinstalled. Same happened. Installed the 32 bit version. Same again.

I guess it's trying to access a driver that it dosn't like - and does this on startup because it's in the saved settings. But this causes it to crash. Is there anyway to change the driver settings without opening the program?

FWIW GO 0.2 is working fine still.

in another field entirely, the 64 bit verison of 0.3 gives me a much worse sound quality than 0.2 - with strange cracking & distortion when it's got lots of stops out. It does this without the bars showing how hard it's working being on full or anywhere near full. 0.2 plays a lot smoother. i'll try and test the 32 bit version when I've solved the problem above!

Tom

Thanks!

[e9925248]

Found a big bug in GO.

I selected an audio driver (can't remember which one!) for GO to use, and it instantly crashed, with a message from microsoft visual C++ Runtime library saying "This application has requested the Runtime to terminate it in an unusual way, please contact the application's support team for more information"

It then CTDed. When I opened it again, it instantly crashed in the same way. I reinstalled. Same happened. Installed the 32 bit version. Same again.

I guess it's trying to access a driver that it dosn't like - and does this on startup because it's in the saved settings. But this causes it to crash. Is there anyway to change the driver settings without opening the program?

Start regedit, navigate to HKEY_Current_User and then Software\Our Organ\ GrandOrgue \ Devices and delete the DefaultSound setting.

The only difference between 32 and 64 bit GO should be, that the 64 bit version is not limited up to 2-3 GB.

GO 0.2 uses a different location for its settings.

in another field entirely, the 64 bit verison of 0.3 gives me a much worse sound quality than 0.2 - with strange cracking & distortion when it's got lots of stops out. It does this without the bars showing how hard it's working being on full or anywhere near full. 0.2 plays a lot smoother. i'll try and test the 32 bit version when I've solved the problem above!

Recommendations:
* Turn lossless compression off.
* Increase latency setting for RtAudio based backends:
Driver names starting with DirectSound: are the RtAudio drivers. Depending on the latency, they process a block 256, 512 or 1024 frames at once.
[The portaudio code is currently fixed at blocks of 256 frames]
Using multiple threads means, that all threads must be synchronized for every block. Lowering the number of threads can reduce this overhead.

[e9925248]

Ok, testing completed. I can confirm that GO dosn't listen on ANY channels if the "any channel" option is selected. Here is how I tested:

Please note, that GO does not only consider channels but also further differentiate between MIDI sources [One program can create multiple MIDI sources].

Is the "Device setting" in the MIDI dialog to "Any device" or to a specific MIDI source?

(If you export the settings, I can look at them)

Another bit of strange behaviour - the SW sub octave activates without any message to activate it.

Elements can have shortcut key defined.

Are you sure, that GO has not generated based on the global settings a Midi Event to listen for and the you sent a matching message?

[7thGalaxy]

I only have one Midi input, so I don't think that it's going to be a problem with multiple inputs. It seems to be sibelius possibly sending controller messages unasked for, for example at a manual change.

The device setting specifies loopbe, which is the only input.

I've increased the latency to 100 - still a slight click, on all of the sound drivers, which I don't get at all in GO 0.2 with the same computer. Same problem on the 32 bit version.

[e9925248]

I only have one Midi input, so I don't think that it's going to be a problem with multiple inputs. It seems to be sibelius possibly sending controller messages unasked for, for example at a manual change.

The device setting specifies loopbe, which is the only input.

wxWidgets on Windows seems to have problems with storing certain values as item data. This could cause the "any channel" problems. I'll put a workaround in the next release.

I've increased the latency to 100 - still a slight click, on all of the sound drivers, which I don't get at all in GO 0.2 with the same computer. Same problem on the 32 bit version.

GO 0.3 will definitly require more CPU power than GO 0.2.

Is the click a load issue [disappers, if you use only one stop / less polyhony], a release alignment problem [occurs, when a note is released - could be caused by a load issue too] or a sound output issue [the click occurs at regular intervals even if only one sample is playing for a long time].

I'm aware of: WASAPI seems suffers from sound output issues and WDM-KS is currently somehow broken.

[7thGalaxy]

I'm using Directsound as it seems the most stable. I've got a brand new laptop, with a pentium i5 processor, so it's significantly faster than the computer I used to run GO 0.2 on, which ran even the biggest organ I used without too much trouble.

The click is a load issue, as you describe it above it happens at a thick part of the texture, specifically in one piece where there is a suspension high in the register, originally the sound sample seems to detune as well, although that has gone away for some reason. The clicks happen mid note, at one specific point in my test piece. The same registration continues for a while, but no more clicking is heard as the texture is thinner.

WASAPI is the driver which instacrashed GO, so I don't want to try it again really!

[Dorsetmike]

Re setting stops; I am not a keyboard player, so I play GO with midi files generated by notation software; I've so far only used GO2, and Finalé Songwriter to generate the Midi file. Initially I found trying to select stops was a right pain in the wotsit I tried using an extra staff on a separate channel and using tied chords to generate note on/off, it worked but was awkward to say the least. I then started using Midiocre to edit in Programme change commands (Cx) to set divisionals having manually set up the divisionals and saved in memory for the work to be played. This works very well for me, but is not much use to anybody playing a keyboard. Changing instruments on a keyboard will achieve the same result, however the only keyboard I have requires 4 key presses to generate i Cx command (function select followed by 3 digits on a numeric pad) so wouldn't be much use except at the start of a work or movement.

In Songwriter (notation software) I set each staff to a separate midi channel and each midi channel plays one keyboard or pedals. I'm using an extended Stiehr-Mockers organ, with Swell set to channel 1, Great to channel 2 and peds to channel 3.

Assuming 8 divisionals per manual select them using Cx 00 through 07 on the channel associated with the relevant manual/pedal, the registration for the start of the work can be assigned by selecting the appropriate "instrument" for each staff to select the required divisionals.

For subsequent settings I edit the midi file using Midiocre inserting a Cx command at the point in the midi file where the registration changes. It as actually possible to change registration more than once in a bar/measure. For a keyboard player select an instrument that generates the CX command number for the required divisional.

The limitation with the basic GO screen is 8 divisionals per manual, however this can be extended in the .organ file, to test this I have 10 working on each manual.

Midiocre is available here --
http://download.cnet.com/Midiocre/30...-10019301.html

Open your midi file, select the track to edit, then select "Events" right click an entry to get a drop down of options, "New" /Midi opens a further window to add or alter any valid midi message like programme or control changes, note on/off and also to set the position within a measure when the change will take place.

Hope this will be of some help, not sure if there are any changes in GO3 to affect registration by this method.

[e9925248]

The limitation with the basic GO screen is 8 divisionals per manual, however this can be extended in the .organ file, to test this I have 10 working on each manual.

Hope this will be of some help, not sure if there are any changes in GO3 to affect registration by this method.

GO 0.3 will support it too. Additionally each organ has automatically 10 generals per manual/peal and 30 generals in addition to the ODF defined elements.

You could use the registration sequencer. Programm the stop changes in the sequence they occur in your music (number 0 - n). Assign 000 to one midi event and next to another. At the start of your song, trigger 000. At each registration change trigger next. As event you can anything you like (Note on 9x, Control Change Bx, Program Change Cx).

GO 0.3 will even support cheap keyboards better, eg. It support the program change extension to use more than 128 different values. You can use a 9x of an unused keyboard key to toogle a stop/tremulant/coupler.