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Thread: Need Help Converting Eminent Organ to VPO

  1. #1
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    Need Help Converting Eminent Organ to VPO

    Greetings, I am an American organist who bought an Eminent Omegan 9000 from a church three years ago. It played for awhile but had some annoying dropouts of pedal notes. While trying to reseat all the circuit boards I somehow made the organ unplayable.

    Three American organ techs have looked at the instrument but none have any clue as to what is wrong, or how to fix it. It had always been in the back of my mind to make a VPO one day, and some time ago I decided to use the Eminent as the donor console.

    Once again I have run into a wall as none of the companies or individuals I am acquainted with who do console conversions understand how the Eminent keyboards are matrixed or how the stop controls and pistons are matrixed. They cannot make the Eminent keyboards or stops work with their MIDI encoders.

    I have invested a lot of time and money into moving this console to Oregon, and to abandon it now would cause serious marital difficulties. As it is, everyday that the Eminent sits in the living-room silent and brooding... ... anyone who could offer help and/or insight would be helping to save a marriage as well as put one more VPO into existence. A worthy undertaking don't you think? But there is no pressure . Thanks in advance.

    H.

  2. #2
    Commander, Assistant Conductor Albert's Avatar
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    Perhaps if you contacted Eminent directly and requested a circuit board diagram? Johannus supplied one when I bought my Opus 10 as standard accessory. It might cost you a bit of postage, but an email doesn't cost anything ...

  3. #3
    Administrator Krummhorn's Avatar
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    Here's the contact info for Eminent (click here).

  4. #4
    Seaman, Mezzoforte
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    Hi,
    Quote Originally Posted by Leisesturm View Post
    Once again I have run into a wall as none of the companies or individuals I am acquainted with who do console conversions understand how the Eminent keyboards are matrixed or how the stop controls and pistons are matrixed. They cannot make the Eminent keyboards or stops work with their MIDI encoders.
    The Omegan 9000 is an analog instrument, so I suspect that it is not matrixed but instead has a single bus bar for each keyboard and probably for the stop controls.
    Otherwisee trying to get the wiring diagrams is a good idea.

  5. #5
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    Quote Originally Posted by astazou View Post
    The Omegan 9000 is an analog instrument, so I suspect that it is not matrixed but instead has a single bus bar for each keyboard and probably for the stop controls.
    Otherwisee trying to get the wiring diagrams is a good idea.
    Eminent told me a long time ago that they no longer support the analog instruments. They are essentially a new company now and have not kept any of the legacy documentation. I did make contact with someone in The Netherlands who sent me a schematic.

    The sound generation of the 9000 is analog in function, but the instrument itself is very solid state. It has discrete components on the circuit boards, but lots of IC's, and it also has MIDI. One technician that has looked at the instrument believes it is a matrixed keyboard, but it uses a non-standard matrix.

    A principal at the MIDI hardware company I contacted has seen pictures I took inside the console. They have suggested that I bypass any of the internal wiring and create a functional scanrow from the key contacts and bus bar. No details on HOW to do this, yet. They say that the schematic provides no details of how the key contacts are matrixed.

  6. #6
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    Hi Leisesturn,

    I have an Eminent 9000 in the shop at present. I would like to shed some light on this instrument and perhaps help you with your quandaries. First of all, this is not an analog instrument. It is very definitely a digital instrument but it is not digitally sampled, it is a digital synthesis instrument. The boards in this organ have static sensitive integrated circuits and should not be handled without your body being connected to earth ground or to the organ ground using a wrist strap, otherwise chips can be destroyed or weakened. The logic uses 8 bit data and the keyboards and stops are multiplexed. The MIDI out carries only keyboard information and not stop activation as far as I can tell. The MIDI in will play whatever stops are turned on at the time from another keyboard. I have not spent time to figure out what channels are used for which keyboard, etc. The service literature does not provide that information, but it appears each keyboard runs on a separate MIDI channel. You could use this MIDI out information to run Hauptwerk or a similar MIDI system. The stops could be wired in parallel to a MIDI encoder and then go out as MIDI information. This would require a technician to rewire the stop switch boards.
    If you decide not to use this organ, I could use the processor from your instrument. I need a ROM chip and they are very hard to find. It is too bad you are not in Canada, I would be happy to repair your organ for you. If you have any questions or need any advice, I would be happy to help out in any way I can.
    Take care,
    Bill005

  7. #7
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    Just one other comment regarding Eminent organs. The company went bankrupt some years ago and the name was sold to another company, I believe German, but my memory is not certain. If you google 'Eminent organs' that is the company that will come up first. They have nothing to do with the organs made by the former company. There is a Dutch fellow that does have service literature and parts for the organs made by the former Dutch company. If anyone is interested, I can provide his contact information. Thank you.

  8. #8
    Rear Admiral Appassionata John Watt's Avatar
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    I'm seeing what Leisesturm is saying, and sure, I'm getting all the organ talk, oh yeah,
    and in fact, despite the trumpets and violins in the distance, that are calling my name,
    I'm seeing the real problem.

    Don't be shy, Leisesturm, we're all here for you. Bill005 must be Canadian, he's amazing.
    If he was in the Niagara Peninsula, watching the water rush by before it powers his organ,
    he'd be playing better. I know he'd feel better about it.

    But this is about you. I really can feel where you are coming from, in Oregon.
    How high up are you?
    For sure, you'll be up there with Greek legends if you strap that on your back,
    to carry it down the mountain, even after you just got it up, and that's how your wife likes it.
    That's a horrible stress to carry. That would downturn any performance, or faked one, I could have.
    Just promise me, that if your wife buys you a solo, ultra-light aircraft for flying along the coast,
    and starts listening to John Denver albums, you won't try it. Please, don't.

    ahhh... having to ground yourself to work on a musical instrument...
    it kinda reminds me of what happens, if my guitar is making little blue sparks with a mike,
    touching the cut end of a string on the headstock to see,
    that's when wiping my guitar along stands and usually the bass player,
    really gets into the tone zone.
    and for very competitive American and Toronto lead guitarists, the plush turns into shiv.
    I'm going to see what Bill007 has to say.

  9. #9
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    Well John, that was a very interesting comment you gave to Leisesturn. I'm not sure it got his problem solved though. But it was good to hear from another Canuk on this forum.

  10. #10
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    How are you making out in your organ conversion? Can I be of any help?

  11. #11
    Rear Admiral Appassionata John Watt's Avatar
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    bill005! You typed my name, you typed my name!
    I had to type that, getting so much New York hip-hop content,
    mostly through American owned Toronto media suppliers.

    I would think your previous posting was more than helpful.
    I also would think that Krummhorn, with a link I didn't look at,
    could be called the thread killer, topic ender, and final forum advice sender.

    He has that effect on me, just a few words, with an authoritative florish.
    He doesn't have to pull out all the stops, just a quiet rush of hot air.
    His fellow employees have to watch out for that.

    It's not that no-one has ever called me a Canuck, here in the Niagara Peninsula,
    but as you can see, living in the middle, between two of the Great Lakes, Erie and Ontario,
    does mean that, while I get the most moderated weather as global warming, in the entire world,
    it is the extremes of that influence, happening all the time from one lake or another,
    that creates my psychological temperament, a tempered, weather-beaten psychology,
    with a growing darkness, when clouds gather as dark circles, seeing small funnels starting to come down,
    a new wind to accompany them, unless it is tornadoes fresh from the south, the disUnited States.

    How's this one, Bill005?
    Did you know, that if you are standing in the lower armature room, below the lower bearing room,
    of a Niagara Falls generator armature, with maybe a ten foot ceiling, and a four foot diameter armature,
    even when it is operating at full speed, you can press your hand against it and not feel it move.
    That's how strong the magnetics are, what I'm typing here,
    while you might want to get into describing some, what, hyper-speed gravitational resistance,
    certainly not some kind of attraction, even if the room atmosphere feels charged all around you.

    My girlfriend and I were hiking down in the Niagara Gorge, and Queenston-Lewiston generator foremen,
    were sitting out, eating their lunch.
    Even though I talked about being a Watt with understandings of the original, and their plant technology,
    I think it was seeing my girlfriend that helped us get inside the most. She couldn't feel the armature either.
    That's true. It was hard to interfere with the strong attraction we felt between us.
    Don't be afraid to post your life out loud, Bill005.
    If you are feeling a little embarrassed, even ashamed,
    that the first You Tube video of you playing the organ that you have the most comfort with,
    is an old Thomas Organ with the Happy Feet option, go for it!
    Last edited by John Watt; Apr-30-2017 at 18:03. Reason: changed have to has

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