Prayer for Burma/Myanmar

[Muza]

Ahh, thats an interesting suggestion. Did not think about that.

[methodistgirl]

Yeah but Mary Magdaline and his mother were also his deciples.
judy tooley

[Muza]

His desciples, not the apostles. And Mary Magdalene was a woman of light behavior, a sinner.

[Krummhorn]

CT64 is absolutely correct ... I looked this up and found this tidbit:

Because the 12 Apostles chosen by Jesus were all male, only men may be ordained in the Catholic Church. This was written in the Roman Catholic Canon Law centuries ago.


That said, the Roman Catholic church concedes that women do have some equally justified roles in Church ministry, that of being missionaries, nuns, and sisters. There is a definite difference between a "nun" and a "sister", btw. Nuns are those who are cloistered in a Monastery, while the work of a Sister is in the greater world, teaching and ministering.

[intet_at_tabe]

I dont know - probably biblical role of women? Eve and the apple, all that stuff.

Or in Israel, women are not allowed to show their arms, for example - has nothing to do with women, it has to do with the fact that the men find it provocative and cant control themselves. So maybe that could also be the reason.

Muza dear and my very good friend Mat

I completely agree with you. We have to remember that in those days, while Jesus Christ was alive and even thousands of years prior to this event, the history shows that the society was a very macho built society. Women were not alowed to interact for instance in religious discussion, politics nor were women alowed to work outside the family (except prostitutes). They took care of the children from birth to the late teen age years and had slaves to help out cleaning the house and some minor agriculture work, if their husbands were important, even officers with the army.

Male children were what every father wanted first and foremost, this still goes for every other man in our world. This is, what I personally find wrong to deny women, acording to the society we all live in today, where ambicious well educated women and feminists have decided years ago that they too have the right to make themselves a career through a long time education, make their own money to support either themselves and a couple of children as a single Mom or support the family.

There are more professors of the female gender today than ever before and more women in the CEC offices in huge corporations and women have fought to be able to represent their local community politically. This is called independence and responsability for the society, we live in and women have this right equally to men also to become politicians and senators. So the Roman Catholic Church, which do not have "any" legal influence in politics any more, do not have the right to deny women, what men have and they will have to change this idea that only men can be clergymen, because of out-dated rules from an old dusty book, written by macho´s.

According to the Bush-league and the ultra-right-wing christian crusadors and the old Testament´s prophecies, women should not be índependent this way. We know for instance that certain cults, but also certain religious groups spread across the entire USA, who believe in A WHITE AMERICA, that they live behind fences far from the cities, or like Waco Texas, or the Jim Jones New Society in South America, that they were ultra-right-wing-christian conservatives, who believe more in the "word" and the old Testament, that God created the world we all live in and that Darwinism - the evolution of Man are crap and a fantasy not approved of by the Old Testament, in their estimation.

Here for these groups,you will find that women mostly have the role of women more than 2000 years ago, at the same time these groups (more than 124 spread across the USA), do not have a regular income, but are highly violent and always are loaded with guns, plastic explosives and any other means and tools of a military attack or defence of their way of life, where all women are basicly 24/7 - mothers and wives.

I don´t believe any woman today having had a life of independence and a career of her own, having fought for the right against men in the USA and elsewhere to be able to vote, would sanction a life back within the four walls of a house or apartment only to be the servant of her man?

We all live in another very modern and progressive society in 2008 and in my best judgement, we can´t keep on dragging on the old ways of life up front. IMHO the death penalty as well as torture are left overs from the Old Testament equals an eye for an eye, equally to the condescending of women, nor is it proper in a modern democratical society in 2008.

I find women in generel more honest than men, and I hate to see from time to time that some women to achieve a career have to be more men than men themself (equals cyniscism) to succeed.

I find all women no matter where they live better judges of most problems in life, and I would love to see 150 of mixed cultures and human skin colour more of them - in the US Congress and in every church.

[methodistgirl]

I agree 100%! Amen brother!
judy tooley

[Contratrombone64]

CT64 is absolutely correct ... I looked this up and found this tidbit:

Because the 12 Apostles chosen by Jesus were all male, only men may be ordained in the Catholic Church. This was written in the Roman Catholic Canon Law centuries ago.


That said, the Roman Catholic church concedes that women do have some equally justified roles in Church ministry, that of being missionaries, nuns, and sisters. There is a definite difference between a "nun" and a "sister", btw. Nuns are those who are cloistered in a Monastery, while the work of a Sister is in the greater world, teaching and ministering.

Sadly, I'm often wrong, but on this I'm spot on. Also a disciple and an apostle are entirely different creatures. There were only 12 apostles, no more, no less. The fact that one of Jesus' followers was a lady of loose morals on sheds light on the fact that he (Jesus) was a man of integrity and compassion.

[methodistgirl]

You are amazingly right on that.
judy tooley

[Muza]

You are absolutely right, but I dont think those big men who write the canon laws think along those paths. And wasnt there some kind of a big deal with an idea that Jesus was married and had children - i think this was one of the big controversies after that DaVinci Code book. I dont see how that really matters also, but they find it very "offensive" for some reason.

[Contratrombone64]

DaVinci Code book should have been burned in the village square for many reasons, not least of which it was dull and badly constructed.

As to canon laws - Moses was just doddling on some clay blocks, left them lying around, and they ended up at the wrong publishing house ... (ducks for cover).

[Muza]

haha, you can say a lot of things about davinci code, but i disagree on the dull argument. I found it to be a nice fairy tale - annoying because everything is always so simple, but definitely not boring.
I actually felt the same way about Angels and Demons, another book by the Dan Brown - although i believe the book was terribly constructed in that the story line was exactly like DaVinci Code (which was actually the 2nd book), but I liked his details, problems and solutions. My experience was actually intensified with this book, because I was reading it about the time when the pope passed away and the new one was to be elected

[Contratrombone64]

Muza - depends entirely on personal taste of course ...

[Muza]

Of course, CT

[methodistgirl]

I just got a picture from the net of a church in Burma and I cried when
I saw this sight. This was a beautiful church like mine and a couple
were getting married when the earthquake happened. I could see just
how horrible it was. This picture made me think of my church and how
pretty it is now. The New Madrid fault woke up just long enough
to wake us up at four o'clock the other morning and we are just fine.
No one was hurt but it did make headlines.
judy tooley