Need advice on buying a keyboard

[Mat]

Hi folks,

Recently I have been introduced with the vast amount of possibilities that come from pluging a midi keyboard with a PC. My jaw dropped to the floor when a friend of mine had shown me what effects you can get with Native Instruments, Cubase, VST, etc.

Anyway, I'd really use some advice.

I am looking for a midi keyboard. The features I need:

• 88-key hammer-action weighted keyboard
• at least 8 adjustable knobs or sliders
• USB port
• pitch bend and modulation wheels
• max price: 750 USD

The CME UF-80 seemed like a perfect match, but I read a lot of unflattering comments about it.

The most important is for the keyboard to be as close to real piano as possible.

Any suggestions?

[greatcyber]

Mat,

Good luck on your search. You may want to look into the Axiom line. I have the Axiom 61, but believe there is also an 88 key model. It has the semi-weighted keys and everything else you mentioned. The version with 61 keys was on sale of $169 USD when I purchased it new a couple of months ago. I love it.

[methodistgirl]

Either get a Casio or a Yamaha because both are pretty good. I had the
Casio keyboard. The Yamaha I think has a place on it where you can
connect it to the computer as a midi.
judy tooley

[Mat]

Thank you for both your responses.

Stephen,

I tried to find Axiom 88 but came up empty-handed. However, while browsing the net in search of M-audio, I found a comparison chart of their products. And I have to tell ya, Keystation PRO 88 looks really nice, has all the features I need (fully-weighted keys) and is cheap. I still have to read some comments about it, but I feel like I'm one step closer. I'll keep looking. Maybe I'll find something even better.

Any other suggestions are still appreciated.


Cheers

[Ntalikeris666]

Yamaha has some small, 88 weighted key low profile cheap models that would do the job

[Mat]

Any particular models in mind?

[Mat]

I purchased the Keystation PRO 88.

Nearly 50 assignable buttons/knobs/sliders, LCD screen, pitch bend and moudlation wheels - those are just some features it has. Some of the keys make a "squeaky" sound when pressed, but apart form that the key action is pretty nice.

For the price I paid, I don't think I could buy anything better.

I still could use a pedalboard but these little creatures are damn expenisve.

[greatcyber]

Amen to that, Mat. I have seen the full convex 2 1/2 octaves for $1500 on Ebay. I guess I really lucked out when I bought that Hammond organ last year for $500. The pedalboard alone is more than worth it. I'm getting closer to hacking it apart for my virtual pipe organ. I have decided to remove the stops and add pistons and 2 more keyboards. I don't need the rhythm portion on top either...especially since not all of the controls are working as intended. AND with the Native Instruments B4 software that I have, I swear it sounds like my mom's old B3.

I finally took delivery of my custom-built desktop computer for music apps only. No internet, antivirus, (no conflicts of drivers) and it is a speed demon. It has 2 internal HDDs: 1 is 500 GB for OS and apps, 1 is 750 GB for sample libraries to stream to the other disk, and yet another external 1 TB for whatever I may need in the future.

I FINALLY got GS3 Orchestra up and running last night after going a little crazy getting the audion card (M-Audio Delta 1010LT that I found on Ebay for $180USD that has 2 sets of breakout cables: 1 set for digital surround sound and 1 set of analogue 8 in/8 out : http://www.thenerds.net/M_AUDIO.M_AU...005075200.html that are fully programable and one day I'll add 1 or 2 more for the ultimate in sound for the VPO.

Mat, the giga piano sounds on the GS3 are phenominal! It also comes with gigapulse pro for convalution and once I was able to being to figure it out, the sound is awesoome and that is only using desktop speakers with a subwoofer ($100USD) on one output and using the aux in of a cheapo all-in-one stereo with small speakers I bought back in Florida for use outside (now I'm glad I didn't sell them).

As I was telling Robin when she was over, after I get the next card installed (whenever) I will attach our "real" stereo with pre-amp, etc. since we really don't need or even use (much) our surround sound in the living room. Then when I crank that baby up, I'll be rattling the walls and windows.

But along with the GS3 came Art Vista grand piano, Boesendorfer 290 and I already had Synthology Ivory and Pianoteq. So the Axiom works great for the piano sounds/temperament and the extra keyboards make an ok VPO for now.

I guess I'll be robbing Peter to pay Paul and eventually wind up with a couple of really nice instruments that cost only a fraction of what the "real deal" would have been. Otherwise I never would have been able to afford anything that would make me happy. But my office is turning into a studio and is a complete mess. But at least it's a fun mess... and a frustrating one until I learn to master all the programs I have accumulated. I'm such a hog when it comes to software, but I keep finding programs that are better and better.

Look forward to hearing how your quest turns out. Maybe you should check with local piano and organ moving companies to see if they have any old organs sitting around gathering dust. When I got the Hammond, that moving company would have gladly given me 3 painos and 3 organs for free, just to get rid of them. Then you would have your pedalboard. I read on one forum where someone got a free pedalboard, bought a cheap casio keyboard, took it apart and used the contacts to make the pedalboard midi-capable and the whole thing cost less than $100! You just have to do a little soldering.

Up for a crafty hobby?

+ YouTube Video

[Mat]

I have seen the full convex 2 1/2 octaves for $1500 on Ebay.

I didn't even dream of the full scale pedalboard. Something like this would really do. Who cares that I'd have to pay much more than I paid for my keyboard.

I guess I really lucked out when I bought that Hammond organ last year for $500

Yes, you did. You lucky ... man

AND with the Native Instruments B4 software that I have, I swear it sounds like my mom's old B3.

Couldn't agree more. It does work like a charm. I assigned most of the Hammond controllers to my keyboard. Shame, I can use only one manual at the time, but I already got used to it. I still can't figure out how do I assign the bank knob to the left of the upper Hammond manual to a controller on my keyboard...

I finally took delivery of my custom-built desktop computer for music apps only. No internet, antivirus, (no conflicts of drivers) and it is a speed demon. It has 2 internal HDDs: 1 is 500 GB for OS and apps, 1 is 750 GB for sample libraries to stream to the other disk, and yet another external 1 TB for whatever I may need in the future.

Holy sh*t, you've got a real monster there. Over 2 TB of space - it's more than I can imagine... True about the safety. Smart solution, but it came with a price, I think.

Mat, the giga piano sounds on the GS3 are phenominal! It also comes with gigapulse pro for convalution and once I was able to being to figure it out, the sound is awesoome and that is only using desktop speakers with a subwoofer ($100USD) on one output and using the aux in of a cheapo all-in-one stereo with small speakers I bought back in Florida for use outside (now I'm glad I didn't sell them).

Never heard of the software you're referring to, to tell you the truth. I use Steinberg The Grand 2 and I simply love it.

I still need to dive deeper into the Cubase-and-such software because I know one can work wonders with it.

But my office is turning into a studio and is a complete mess. But at least it's a fun mess... and a frustrating one until I learn to master all the programs I have accumulated. I'm such a hog when it comes to software, but I keep finding programs that are better and better.

I wouldn't mind that kind of mess at all. Hope you'll share the results of your hard work with us (some pics or recordings), won't you?

Look forward to hearing how your quest turns out. Maybe you should check with local piano and organ moving companies to see if they have any old organs sitting around gathering dust.

That is ... an unusual idea. But maybe in an act of despair, having not found the pedalboard anywhere else, I'll give it a try. But all jokes aside, that's a good tip, I'd've never thought of it myself. Thanks, Stephen.

Up for a crafty hobby?

Yeah, I know this commercial. Have been wondering what model he's playing. Oh, and the first 'note' is slightly out of tune.

I'll keep you informed on my new purchases. Thanks to that equipment I was finally able to record my fugue and upload it to this site.

[greatcyber]

Hey Mat,

I also have the Steinberg Grand II which I think is also a wonderful sounding organ. Since you mention that you want to dig deeper into Cubase (which I also have...but then, what DON'T I have?), I may have found a solution for you. It would cost 15 Euros, but you can download a demo (fully working for 15 minutes before you have to unload and reload) but as you will be using the B4 as a VST, there is a new controller program (also a VST controller) which sends CC #100 to control the bank selector.



You can get the info and demo here: http://www.midikarval.net/_mgxroot/page_10749.html

So far, with everything I have gotten my hands on, I haven't really played with all the programs fully. I am trying to master Sonar, but also have Cubase and Nuendo. So when I "play" and really am just "playing around" so I have mostly used just stand-alone. But since you are going the VST route, give this a try. I'd be curious to hear the results of what you think.

I hope this helps you out in some small way.

BTW, since you are now only using one keyboard, do you have it split?

I also got the very basic and free VST Host which started me down this crazy road to overindulgence of software.

I also have 2 external HDD of 1 terrabyte each for my laptop. Aside from holding all of my music (500 CDs) there is also now residing there 564 Gig of library samples.

I'm surprised that you haven't heard of GigaStudio 3 Orchestra before. There is now a GigaStudio 4. I bought a new and unopened copy online from a guy in New Orleans that I found on the gigastudio forum. It also has some Vienna Symphonic Library samples. Crap, I have my laptop talking to me in French now, have Cleopatra dancing around the screen telling me what time it is and what the weather is, little characters popping up telling me how swell I am and offering up little jokes. I have her read my emails to me in a nice British accent. I admit it, I am a total nerd and geek when it comes to computers.

Will keep my eye on this thread to see what you think of this rotary control. I downloaded the demo but haven't played with it yet. Too much software, too little time. lol.

[Contratrombone64]

Coke have no shame

[Mat]

Hello Stephen,

I also have the Steinberg Grand II which I think is also a wonderful sounding organ.

Organ? Are we talking about the same software? I use Steinberg the Grand as a piano plug-in...

As for the Cubase, I used it at the very beginnig of my VST/MIDI journey. Later, a friend who is deep into this kind of stuff recommended that I use REAPER instead. So, that's what I've been using ever since.

Thank you for the "B4 controller' link. I may give it a try a bit later. Although, I was hoping for an easier solution. Bummer that I have to use an external software to controll the bank knob.

I also use most of my software in the stand-alone mode. I ask REAPER for help only if I have to work with more than one instrument at a time, or when I have to do recording and editing stuff.

I've been experimenting with spliting the B4 keyboard but I can't find the right way to do it. When playing jazz (and having only one keyboard), it's useful to have it split. Left side for chords on lower manual with a bit more quiet 'registration' and right for improvising on upper manual with a full blast, but my hands keep crossing and the effect is often lost. Hope you understand what I mean...

I feel infected. I want more and more, so I'm not surprised about your
overindulgence of software. In my case it's partly because of this site:

http://www.pcorgan.com/indexEN.html

I clicked on the Pictures tab and then it all began. Seeing what other people have in their homes made me indecently jealous. Now I want a touch LCD sreen, another keyboard and God knows what else. And yes, I am ashamed of myself

Not to mention the Hauptwerk software, of course. This site is full of their software's samples. It's really breathtaking - the quality of sound. But €199.00 for Basic Edition + the price of samples stops me effectively from buying it.

Also, I a shame I can't get the GrandOrgue to work as the REAPER plug-in...

I will have to talk about GigaStudio 3 Orchestra with my friend and see if he know it or uses it.

Too much software, too little time.

The same here. I should go outside and breathe some fresh air.

I have one question. What's the NGBO you mentioned in other thread?

Thanks for your tips.

[greatcyber]

I meant piano...it was late, sorry.

For jOrgan, here is the link for what you asked about: http://www.rite-instruments.de/data/entry.htm

I just wish you could actually see all of the organs and pianos I have acquired on my computers now. And all of the other amazing sounds of indescribable instruments from Native Instruments, EWQL, Yellow Tools Independence Free (as the name implies, it is loaded with samples) and the now free Kore Player with even more samples (NI).

Seems as though we visit many of the same sites and those darned things start the addiction. At least it's a good addiction, right?

Here's another that's "in the works" from that site:

Well, I hadn't heard of Reaper, so now I'll have to check into that, too! Now do you see why I need so much storage space on HDDs? Such piggies, we.

[Mat]

This jOrgan thing looks really promising. Actually, I downloaded it and installed. Installation went well but I can't get it to play. Apperently, configuring it with my keyboard is over my head...

Reaper is a software similar to Cubase but million times better, as my friend says. I trust him.

I would love to see the complete software collection of yours. It sure sounds very tempting. And the Hammond, of course, too.

As for the addiction, it's far better than collecting stamps, healthier than smoking, but with the computer and the keyboard running all the time I don't really wait impatiently for the electric bill to come...

[Mat]

Hey Stephen,

Got some new software. Thought I'd share.

Sibelius 6 for starters. Haven't had time to get acquainted with it yet. The most I can do with it so far is to open a new project... I am aware of the possibilities it has to offer and I keep telling mylelf I will find somebody who can guide me through all the features. Unfortunately, new responsibilities keep coming up... I really wish I could have a few days off to learn how to use it properly.

PMI Barogue Organ - basically a set of predifined sounds you can choose from, and mix them, too. The advantage is that if you run it on Reaper/Cubase/etc. and record something, there is plenty of editing stuff possible to do afterwards.

Scarbee, a vintage keyboard sounds. The kind of sound Chick Corea uses (among others, of course). Here's what I mean: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=huIcAdTbMbM

And here's something you might like:
http://www.spectrasonics.net/instrum...ian_videos.php

I am absolutely delighted with their double-bass. Just look at the videos. I want that software!