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Thread: moi vs vu

  1. #1
    Commodore con Forza EddieRUKiddingVare's Avatar
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    moi vs vu

    Rate these two iconic bands from the 60's early 70's

    MOI - Mothers of Invention (or just Mothers) and VU Velvet Underground (or Velvets) with or without Nico..

    Now these bands were both produced by Tom Wilson (who first signed them both) and were both popular at the same time and both tried on outlandish music for the time. And more importantly Frank and Lou hated each other....


    For the unintitate (if there are any?) straight Wiki version below - don't want to influence anyone - I like both bands but for different versions.

    MOI - The Mothers of Invention were an American rock band from California that served as the backing musicians for Frank Zappa, a self-taught composer and performer whose diverse musical influences led him to create music that was often impossible to categorize[citation needed]. Their work is marked by the use of sonic experimentation, innovative album art, and elaborate live shows.

    Originally an R&B band called The Soul Giants, the band's original lineup included Ray Collins, David Coronado, Ray Hunt, Roy Estrada and Jimmy Carl Black. Zappa was asked to take over as the band's guitarist following a fight between Collins and the band's original guitarist. Zappa insisted that the band perform original material, changing their name to The Mothers. Founded in 1964, the band first became popular playing in California's underground music scene in the late 1960s. Under Zappa's leadership, the band signed to Verve Records, releasing a début album, Freak Out! (1966), with a lineup which consisted of Zappa, Collins, Black, Estrada and Elliot Ingber.

    Under Zappa's leadership and a fluctuating lineup, the band released a series of acclaimed albums, including Absolutely Free, We're Only in It for the Money and Uncle Meat, before being disbanded by Zappa in 1969. In 1970, Zappa formed a new lineup of The Mothers which included Ian Underwood, Jeff Simmons, George Duke, Aynsley Dunbar and singers Mark Volman and Howard Kaylan, formerly of The Turtles, who were credited as The Phlorescent Leech & Eddie for contractual reasons. Later adding another ex-Turtle, bassist Jim Pons, this lineup lasted until the end of 1971, when Zappa was injured by an audience member during a concert.


    VU- The Velvet Underground was an American rock band formed in New York City. First active from 1964 to 1973, their best-known members were Lou Reed and John Cale, who both went on to find success as solo artists. Although experiencing little commercial success while together, the band is often cited by many critics as one of the most important and influential groups of the 1960s.[1] In a 1982 interview Brian Eno made the often repeated statement that while the first Velvet Underground album may have sold only 30,000 copies in its early years, "everyone who bought one of those 30,000 copies started a band."[2]

    Andy Warhol managed the Velvet Underground and it was the house band at his studio, the Factory, and his Exploding Plastic Inevitable events. The provocative lyrics of some of the band's songs gave a nihilistic outlook to some of their music.[3][4]

    Their 1967 debut album, The Velvet Underground & Nico (which featured German singer Nico, with whom the band collaborated), was named the 13th Greatest Album of All Time, and the "most prophetic rock album ever made" by Rolling Stone in 2003.[5][6] In 2004, Rolling Stone ranked the band No. 19 on its list of the "100 Greatest Artists of All Time".[7] The band was inducted into the Rock and Roll Hall of Fame in 1996, by Patti Smith.

  2. #2
    Commodore con Forza EddieRUKiddingVare's Avatar
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    Please to see MOI are winning by a mile.............

  3. #3
    Duckmeister teddy's Avatar
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    Not any more Eddie

    teddy
    Pining for the South of France

  4. #4
    Commodore con Forza EddieRUKiddingVare's Avatar
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    Yes and yes and yes i'm a Zappa freak...

    and thanks Teddy for the yellow snowball

    Wild Man Fisher yes and did you know Frank discovered and produce other artists such as Alice Cooper (same zappa lable as Wild Man) and Tim Buckley (see http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Straight_Records)

    Oh and audience injury yep - that happened in the UK, Rainbow Theatre London,when some crazed guy thought Zappa was given his girl the eye in the audienceand he pulling Zappa of stage into the orchestra pit – severely injuring him.In hospital when came to apparently the first words he said were Peaches EnRegalia lol
    He could not walk for a period of time - one of his legsended up shorter (hence lyrics in Zombie Wolf) and his voice drop an octave orthird or something!
    Last edited by EddieRUKiddingVare; Mar-28-2013 at 03:43.

  5. #5
    Commodore con Forza EddieRUKiddingVare's Avatar
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    "Motherly Love" hey very good, from Freak Out album

    Peaches En Regalia very nice

  6. #6
    Commodore con Forza EddieRUKiddingVare's Avatar
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    MOI- still winning!

    More thoughts on the MOI vs Vu debate - the reason I raised them for discussion was as they both spanned the same time period in rock, were experimental, were not widely received initially and became so well known, it seemed a good idea
    One East coast the other west coast and during the sixties Zappa's Mothers of Invention and The Velvet Underground with Lou Reed and John Cale were competitors for the promotion budget of MGM, for which both groups were contracted.

    Zappa and Lou also had ongoing feud for many years with quotes such as:

    "Frank Zappa is the most untalented musician I've ever heard. He's a two-bit pretentious academic, He can't play rock 'n roll because he's a loser...". Lou Reed

    On the tapes for Zappa's "We're only in it for the money" The Velvet Underground got mentioned via a musician complaining that he has to play Zappa's creations and to make matters worse, he has to play with the Velvet Undergroud the next day, "just as shitty a group"


    The reason they differ is that they are so similar

    Both:
    - started their careers as Doo Wop producers
    - fused rock and roll with, shall we say, highbrow influences
    - saw their groups as extensions of themselves
    - had formidable female members in their groups (Ruth and Nico)
    - made less successful records of "electronic music" (e.g. Franceco and Metal Machine)
    - had dancers in their act
    - had deep, idiosyncratic voices
    - would re-arrange their songs throughout their career
    - significantly changed their sound in the early 70's after breaking up their groups
    - were produced by Tom Wilson
    - were known for having bizarre fashion sense.
    - had bass players who alienated their groups (Scott Thunes and John Cale)

    I think the fact that they are so similar, is why a feud existed between them also.

    Interestingly Lou Reed inducted Frank Zappa into The Rock N Roll Hall Of Fame!
    "I respected him and I know he respected me," said Reed after comparing Zappa to Andy Warhol
    actually, Frank admired Lou as a songwriter; Femme Fatale and All Tomorrow's Parties were two of Frank's favorites!

  7. #7
    Commodore con Forza EddieRUKiddingVare's Avatar
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  8. #8
    Captain of Water Music musicteach's Avatar
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    I have no comment on the bands, I was thinking you were saying "me v. you". Oops.
    Music education opens doors that help children pass from school into the world around them-a world of work, culture, intellectual activity, and human involvement. The future of our Nation depends on providing our children with a complete education that includes music. -Gerald Ford

  9. #9
    Commodore con Forza EddieRUKiddingVare's Avatar
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    Don't forget the GTO's

  10. #10
    Commodore con Forza EddieRUKiddingVare's Avatar
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    I think Girls Outrageously Together would win that one

    or where you referring to the MC5
    from Lincoln Park Michigan


  11. #11
    Commodore con Forza EddieRUKiddingVare's Avatar
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    good to MOI still in lead

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