Contratrombone64
Admiral of Fugues
Thanks god I'm an athiest.
True believers are murderers, according to some
- Thread starter Contratrombone64
- Start date
JHC
Chief assistant to the assistant chief
Corno Dolce
Admiral Honkenwheezenpooferspieler
Naaaaaaaw, really CT64?
Contratrombone64
Admiral of Fugues
My word, hope it's not a problem?
Corno Dolce
Admiral Honkenwheezenpooferspieler
Hey CT64,
Please worry not what I think, ok?
Cheerio,
CD
Please worry not what I think, ok?
Cheerio,
CD
methodistgirl
New member
It takes more faith to be an atheist than I need to be a christian. To me
it doesn't really matter what church name I belong to if it be a protestant
one,catholic,even the jewish faith. There is one thing that rings true and
that is the bible. I've been to almost all of the protestant churches from
baptist to methodist and it doesn't matter to me. I just know what the
bible says. What I will be judged by is if I did God's will and followed what
the bible said from the ten commandments to revelations. The apostle's
creed does mention the holy catholic church. What the creed really
talks about is the universal church as holy catholic church. Not the
Roman catholic church like many thinks it is. Being a baptist or a
methodist is just a name like when a girl gets married. She gives up
her maiden name and takes on her husband's sir name to be called
Mrs. Someone. My real name is judy tooley and my maiden name is
Powell. So I consider just having the church name while being a
true follower of Christ like I should be doing. Not following after some
man made doctrine.
judy tooley
it doesn't really matter what church name I belong to if it be a protestant
one,catholic,even the jewish faith. There is one thing that rings true and
that is the bible. I've been to almost all of the protestant churches from
baptist to methodist and it doesn't matter to me. I just know what the
bible says. What I will be judged by is if I did God's will and followed what
the bible said from the ten commandments to revelations. The apostle's
creed does mention the holy catholic church. What the creed really
talks about is the universal church as holy catholic church. Not the
Roman catholic church like many thinks it is. Being a baptist or a
methodist is just a name like when a girl gets married. She gives up
her maiden name and takes on her husband's sir name to be called
Mrs. Someone. My real name is judy tooley and my maiden name is
Powell. So I consider just having the church name while being a
true follower of Christ like I should be doing. Not following after some
man made doctrine.
judy tooley
JLS
Member
Faith is blind unjustified belief. Theism is the belief in some deity/deities. Atheism is simply the position that theism is false. Where in that is there faith?
There are many, many different theistic positions. Some I find coherent, some not, most I am unaware of. On the coherent ones, I am atheistic*. On the incoherent ones, I am noncognitivist. On the rest, I have no position yet. To have a position on only one of the nearly countless religions out there is insular and narrow-minded.
* ...so far. If I am presented with a coherent, rigorous and meaningful theism that stands up to rational examination I may change my tune.
There are many, many different theistic positions. Some I find coherent, some not, most I am unaware of. On the coherent ones, I am atheistic*. On the incoherent ones, I am noncognitivist. On the rest, I have no position yet. To have a position on only one of the nearly countless religions out there is insular and narrow-minded.
* ...so far. If I am presented with a coherent, rigorous and meaningful theism that stands up to rational examination I may change my tune.
JHC
Chief assistant to the assistant chief
But is not Religion a "Man made doctrine" ??
methodistgirl
New member
For some of us musicians here in this forum I believe a lot us have
went through the same as a lot of famous people like Neil Diamond.
He had a real tough time getting to where he is today. I have a
video that explains it.YouTube - Neil Diamond - BBC Concert - Man Of God
judy tooley
went through the same as a lot of famous people like Neil Diamond.
He had a real tough time getting to where he is today. I have a
video that explains it.YouTube - Neil Diamond - BBC Concert - Man Of God
judy tooley
sunwaiter
New member
hi.
many points of view have been displayed here since the firts post, and a topic about religion is always a sure way to discover one self, and sometimes let one self go to verbal extremities, that is to say refusal to switch and maybe change these points of view just for the sake of understanding. many people don't even try to talk to those who don't speak the same langage and i'm happy to see that on some forums like this one, people have what it takes to really try.
as for me, science can be dangerous when taken too seriously, but it seems that it's the best way to try to understand life. the only thing that pushes me to almost mystical thoughts is universe expansion, or simply put, the idea that something never ends. this is the most interesting scientific topic ever, as far as i know, and i'm not a scientist at all, my culture in tis domain being very weak.
i don't personnally like the concept of religion. i like the concept of faith. everyone should find his own way of understanding what he/she is here for. i respect all beliefs and all superstitions, even if some make me want to scream out loud my disagreement, and i respect them as long as they are not parasites preventing me to do what i like and what i feel i have the right to do. morals is the ultimate frontier of acceptance, and we all have to work on that, i BELIEVE, without scientific fanatism, without religious fanatism, without political fanatism.
random choice: bill withers - can we pretend
and uh, i don't see ussr and maoist china as nations based upon atheism, though it sure was a part of it. saddam hussein led a laicist country, iran is an islamic nation, today's france is, to tell things as they are, inhabited with much more atheist people than figures will tell, and it seems the usa did not separate power and church ( amazing ).
many points of view have been displayed here since the firts post, and a topic about religion is always a sure way to discover one self, and sometimes let one self go to verbal extremities, that is to say refusal to switch and maybe change these points of view just for the sake of understanding. many people don't even try to talk to those who don't speak the same langage and i'm happy to see that on some forums like this one, people have what it takes to really try.
as for me, science can be dangerous when taken too seriously, but it seems that it's the best way to try to understand life. the only thing that pushes me to almost mystical thoughts is universe expansion, or simply put, the idea that something never ends. this is the most interesting scientific topic ever, as far as i know, and i'm not a scientist at all, my culture in tis domain being very weak.
i don't personnally like the concept of religion. i like the concept of faith. everyone should find his own way of understanding what he/she is here for. i respect all beliefs and all superstitions, even if some make me want to scream out loud my disagreement, and i respect them as long as they are not parasites preventing me to do what i like and what i feel i have the right to do. morals is the ultimate frontier of acceptance, and we all have to work on that, i BELIEVE, without scientific fanatism, without religious fanatism, without political fanatism.
random choice: bill withers - can we pretend
and uh, i don't see ussr and maoist china as nations based upon atheism, though it sure was a part of it. saddam hussein led a laicist country, iran is an islamic nation, today's france is, to tell things as they are, inhabited with much more atheist people than figures will tell, and it seems the usa did not separate power and church ( amazing ).
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Corno Dolce
Admiral Honkenwheezenpooferspieler
Aloha sunwaiter,
Just to put a fine point on it, whose moral standards? Us humans? We who are never free of pride, self-interest, envy, vanity, and dozens of other defects? Please don't think that I'm a misanthrope - I am not.
Humbly,
CD
Just to put a fine point on it, whose moral standards? Us humans? We who are never free of pride, self-interest, envy, vanity, and dozens of other defects? Please don't think that I'm a misanthrope - I am not.
Humbly,
CD
sunwaiter
New member
that was exactly my point, Corno Dolce. Whose moral standards? there is no standard, besides what we call humanity. and even this idea takes too many shapes. some people don't see death and pain the same way at all, therefore people do torture, deliberately hurt and kill other people, sometimes thinking it is the right thing to do to solve a problem. it's mind-boggling because it looks like it will never lead to any satisfying conclusion. human societies evolve and then... revolve ( i don't if the term is appropriate, i'm french ). my favourite example to illustrate my point is what happened in rwanda in 1994. i could choose many other wars or genocides but this one is fresh enough in our minds. it was the climax, the explosion of a long history of hate ( of which i won't try to give a precise or historical report here ), built on a colonialism basis. well, hutus killed tutsis in huge numbers and i remember at the time i could not even imagine a single glimpse of motive for all this, even less when i saw the "methods" used to terminate the tutsis. it seemed that happened in another time and planet, but these were human beings, all of them. their brains are the same as yours and mine, they are sensitive, sad, joyous, have families, etc. as for the nazis when the camps were discovered, you usually ask yourself why such a thing. what were the moral standards?
all this to say, Corno and anyone who should read this pretentious chite, that i'm not a misanthrope either, but sometimes i feel out of courage. and then i convince myself that finally, we all have the same idea of what an absolute moral standard should be, though we always fail to practice what we preach. everywhere we're in search of the same thing, and everybody knows it's not money, sayks, power etc. these are just ways to protect ourselves and to survive.
sorry for the cheesy style, but that was sincere.
random: santana - free angela
all this to say, Corno and anyone who should read this pretentious chite, that i'm not a misanthrope either, but sometimes i feel out of courage. and then i convince myself that finally, we all have the same idea of what an absolute moral standard should be, though we always fail to practice what we preach. everywhere we're in search of the same thing, and everybody knows it's not money, sayks, power etc. these are just ways to protect ourselves and to survive.
sorry for the cheesy style, but that was sincere.
random: santana - free angela
methodistgirl
New member
He is right by saying that faith is blind. That's true so I will say that faith
is hope that is unseen. It's like an unseen promise. Ever had someone to
promise you something and you expect the promise to happen but it doesn't
come to pass until that person finally acts on it. That is what faith is like
in what you believe in whether it's God or any other substance. Before the
Lord ascended to heaven He left all of us with a promise and we need to
be faithful to it. Faith is like the smallest seed you ever planted. I will
say a vanilla seed is probably the smallest or even the human egg. After
fertilization you need to follow just what the doctor says to do and follow
a guideline so that that you produce a healthy child. That's kinda like
faith. But you have to put forth effort for your faith to work. Do what
the Bible says and not what Rev. Simon Say's. That is how I see it.
judy tooley
Corno Dolce
Admiral Honkenwheezenpooferspieler
Aloha sunwaiter,
Good points you bring to the table. Now then, since a human is doomed to die, his task on earth evidently must be of a more spiritual nature. It cannot be unrestrained enjoyment of everyday life. It cannot be the search for the best ways to obtain material goods and then cheerfully get the most out of them. It has to be the fulfillment of a permanent, earnest duty so that one's life journey may become an experience of moral growth, so that one may leave life a better human being than one started it.
What then does humanity base its moral standards on? Things just don't happen by themselves even though there are legions of scientists and humanists trying to persuade people that just such is the case.
Humbly,
CD
Good points you bring to the table. Now then, since a human is doomed to die, his task on earth evidently must be of a more spiritual nature. It cannot be unrestrained enjoyment of everyday life. It cannot be the search for the best ways to obtain material goods and then cheerfully get the most out of them. It has to be the fulfillment of a permanent, earnest duty so that one's life journey may become an experience of moral growth, so that one may leave life a better human being than one started it.
What then does humanity base its moral standards on? Things just don't happen by themselves even though there are legions of scientists and humanists trying to persuade people that just such is the case.
Humbly,
CD
JHC
Chief assistant to the assistant chief
Why do we have to have a spiritual task, surly mans purpose, if there is one, is to survive and reproduce. We just may not be the centre of the UV or UVsAloha sunwaiter,
his task on earth evidently must be of a more spiritual nature.
CD
OK,I am interested, please give an example
Corno Dolce
Admiral Honkenwheezenpooferspieler
Aloha J.H.C.
By what you have shared that man is only to survive and reproduce you leave room for little else that signifies a betterment of the human race. In other words, I interpret what you say to be that it is alright to be rapacious in one's consumption and not carefully manage, cultivate, and nurture that which is around us.
Surely, that must not be your intention, eh? Think about it: Survive and Reproduce - just like an animal. We can certainly have animalistic tendencies but we are born with a brain for doing things that animals can't. Center of the Universe? Nawww!...Alone? Yes!
You'll probably disagree with me there - hey, you're entitled to your opinion - I'm not here to browbeat. I have done research in Astronomy(Physical Cosmology) at the University level so I am familiar with the power but also the limitation of the Scientific Process. Anyway, there is more to life than just survive and reproduce.
Cheerio,
CD
By what you have shared that man is only to survive and reproduce you leave room for little else that signifies a betterment of the human race. In other words, I interpret what you say to be that it is alright to be rapacious in one's consumption and not carefully manage, cultivate, and nurture that which is around us.
Surely, that must not be your intention, eh? Think about it: Survive and Reproduce - just like an animal. We can certainly have animalistic tendencies but we are born with a brain for doing things that animals can't. Center of the Universe? Nawww!...Alone? Yes!
You'll probably disagree with me there - hey, you're entitled to your opinion - I'm not here to browbeat. I have done research in Astronomy(Physical Cosmology) at the University level so I am familiar with the power but also the limitation of the Scientific Process. Anyway, there is more to life than just survive and reproduce.
Cheerio,
CD
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sunwaiter
New member
science always looked quite cold to me, i mean not very human, because of the statistical, rationalizing attitude and principles that are the declared fondamentals of it. it's true that sometimes scienitsts think they know something, when they're totally wrong ( often because later other scientists find out the detail (s) that blew it all ). generally we call this process a progress. as mister T.Van Leer from the band Focus once said, [if] it's not a revolution, it's an evolution. cause that's the fatal error scientists AND philosophers made at certain times: they thought they brought revolution, meaning definitive progress, change. scientific researchers nowadays seem to be humble enough to avoid the same situation.
today, even if i'm an almost total ignorant in science, i can see it in a different way. i'm not the skeptical or superstitious redneck but i'm not the sure-of-it-all science fanatic either. nevertheless i think faith in science is much more interesting than any other, even if in the end we discover that nothing ever existed, or that we're part of a comic book in the hands of a "superior" being, or that finally, the earth is flat...
There is a famous ( lately turned hated and media-crushed ) comedian in my country, named Dieudonné, whose one character ( a teacher... ), talking to a muslim father says:
"I respect your religion [...] me? oh, er, i like jazz. Good thing about it is that it's in any direction you like"
this man is not really religion-friendly but at least he respects other points of view, as you all do on this forum, in a very honorable and trust-inspiring way.
another piece of his show tells us about the "nothing" church, the cult of nothing. here he talks for himself, because he would like people to believe in nothing in particular, if not themselves i presume. and i have to admit this would be so nice, and so much simpler.
today, even if i'm an almost total ignorant in science, i can see it in a different way. i'm not the skeptical or superstitious redneck but i'm not the sure-of-it-all science fanatic either. nevertheless i think faith in science is much more interesting than any other, even if in the end we discover that nothing ever existed, or that we're part of a comic book in the hands of a "superior" being, or that finally, the earth is flat...
There is a famous ( lately turned hated and media-crushed ) comedian in my country, named Dieudonné, whose one character ( a teacher... ), talking to a muslim father says:
"I respect your religion [...] me? oh, er, i like jazz. Good thing about it is that it's in any direction you like"
this man is not really religion-friendly but at least he respects other points of view, as you all do on this forum, in a very honorable and trust-inspiring way.
another piece of his show tells us about the "nothing" church, the cult of nothing. here he talks for himself, because he would like people to believe in nothing in particular, if not themselves i presume. and i have to admit this would be so nice, and so much simpler.
Corno Dolce
Admiral Honkenwheezenpooferspieler
Aloha sunwaiter,
I for one am interested in entertaining many different points of view whether they be Theist, Atheist or whatever nuance. I stumbled upon this forum one year ago and it intrigued me with its many varied and storied wonderful members who are so precious - I immediately became addicted - Now I can't get off of this fix.
Cheerio,
CD
I for one am interested in entertaining many different points of view whether they be Theist, Atheist or whatever nuance. I stumbled upon this forum one year ago and it intrigued me with its many varied and storied wonderful members who are so precious - I immediately became addicted - Now I can't get off of this fix.
Cheerio,
CD