The largest pipe organ in the world!?!

[greatcyber]

I came across this post while surfing and found it quite interesting. There are several links where you can hear this 7 manual beast playing. It truly is a beautiful instrument.

http://www.acchos.org/

Hope you like it.

 

[jhnbrbr]

Thanks Stephen, Very interesting - I hadn't come across that organ before. . I always thought the Wanamaker organ in the department store at Philadelphia was the world's largest, but presumably that is #2. Does anyone know the complete league table of (say) the largest five in the world? Size isn't everything, of course, and if I try to remember the three most utterly incredible, life-changing listenng experiences of my life they were all relatively modest instruments in the more intimate surroundings of college chapels or parish churches.

 

[Krummhorn]

The Atlantic City organ is the largest pipe organ, but not the largest fully operational pipe organ.

The top 5 list goes like this:

1. Wanamaker ---------- VI/463 - Harris/Quimby
2. Atlantic City -------- VII/449 - Midmer-Losh
3. West Point ---------- IV/380 - Möller
4. 1st Congregational --- V/354 - Skinner/Schlicker. Has twin identical consoles
5. Passau, Germany ---- V/326

By comparison, the Crystal Cathedral (Garden Grove, CA) is a V/278.

The data above is according to Martin Doering's site

 

[jhnbrbr]

Thanks for the info Kh. Presumably the twin identical consoles of 1st Congregational can be used for duets, which is a sensible way of making full use of such vast resources. I can't really see the point of having seven manuals for just one player in the Atlantic City organ. The Birmingham (UK) Symphony Hall organ has two non-identical consoles, one movable, and one fixed (tracker action) and I believe they can be used simultaneously, but I've never seen it done.

 

[Krummhorn]

You're Welcome :tiphat:

At 1st Cong, one console is in the gallery, the other in the chancel. If memory serves my correctly there is also a very complete "continuo" organ as part of the specs for that church - playable from the chancel console.

I had attended a concert of the late E. Power Biggs play that organ when it was a "smaller" instrument of 215 ranks.

 

[Corno Dolce]

Aloha jhnbrbr,

Might you be aware that the Atlantic City Conventional Hall Organ has also a five-manual console? It is however disconnected and kept in storage but the whole organ can be controlled from it:

http://www.flickr.com/photos/rossmcneillie/1590771924/

 

[greatcyber]

Yes, I read that when I found this other link. It's all very interesting.

You really need to be giraffe to see the to keys

 

[Corno Dolce]

Aloha GC,

Yeah, but its quite the instrument - I know I have been quite dismissive of the whole contraption for years on end but I still do admire the dream behind it all - that of Sen. Richards. The dude knew how to *think outside the box* - no doubt about it!!!

It would just be so cool if it could be brought back to total functionality and recordings of different repertoire done on it.

Cheers,

CD

 

[Krummhorn]

. . . It would just be so cool if it could be brought back to total functionality and recordings of different repertoire done on it.

Amen to that, brother ...
And it appears they are working to completely restore it to playing condition ... not an easy task, even for an organ builder.

 

[dll927]

How did some of you guys miss that Atlantic City monster all this time? It's been publicized to no end for eons. Only problem, it is billed as "only partly functional". The Wanamaker in Phillie is considered that largest FUNCTIONAL organ.

I've heard the First Congregational organ a number of times, but that was when it was still a "smaller" four-manual. I don't live in the L.A. area any more. But that church is more than worth a visit.

The Crystal Cathedral also has two consoles, but they are not identical, in fact they look quite different. Given the apparent politics around that place, they have had several different organists since Swann left, and I'm not even sure who is doing it right now. Pardini is back east again.

In both of the above cases, there are really at least two organs at opposite ends. First Congregational lived for well over 30 years with its original Skinner. Then somebody unloaded some money on them and they put the Schlicker up in the rear balcony (which is exactly what it had been) in 1969. Now they have added even more, and I assume they have taken out the seating above the crossing sides and put pipes up there, too. (There seem to be some politics there, too, as they can't seem to settle on a senior pastor. Dr. Fifield was the senior pastor for 32 years, and since he retired - about 1967 - they have been through a whole roll call of pastors.) That church was once known as a citadel of conservatism around L.A., apparently when Fifield was there.

 

[dll927]

Same added notes:

I take it that most of the reason Atlantic City is "only partly functional" is that it belongs to a municipality, which has other budget worries these days. The rather famous organ at St. Bavo in Haarlem, Holland supposedly belongs to the city, which seems a somewhat strange arrangement.

I have often wondered if the reason so many European organs are left "as is" (St. Sulpice?) is that those countries have "ministries of culture" that, once something is famous, they won't let it be touched. On the other hand the Cavaille-Coll at Notre Dame was ransacked for an electric-action job way back in the 1960's.

I read the other day that Peter Baicchi, once the associate organist at the Crystal Cathedral, died last year at the age of 38. Rather curious. Could he have been the same type as Lloyd Holzgraf, the long-time organist at First Congregational, who was known for liking the guys?

Both of those churches seem to have their in-fighting. As is well-known, Schuller kicked his own son out of the place. Nice going, Dad.

 

[Corno Dolce]

Somewhat quite off-topic:

A few years ago I heard something on the Coconut Wireless that a reason for Maestro Swann's departure from the Crystal Palace was because of Schuller's daughter and her distaste for big organs - She apparently had wanted the orchestral ensemble to have a higher profile. Alot of the membership, both in-situ and of the radio/television ministry can only identify with the Senior Schuller. So, the day when he reposes will be a very trying chapter for that establishment - Its all bound up in Schuller senior. In a way, I'm glad that I'm not a member of that Church. For me at least, a priest should not have such celebrity status. Yes, he has worked very hard but the glory should go to God, not Schuller senior.

 

[Krummhorn]

You are spot on, CD, about the Crystal place. Between the years of 1950 and 1980, I lived in Garden Grove (CA) ... back in those days it was called Garden Grove Community Church and the building they now call the "Arboretum" was the sanctuary. Richard Unfried was the organist there for many years. Some people made reference, even in those days, to doing the "Schuller Shuffle" ... I had applied once for the position of assistant organist there - at that time they had a 33 rk Wick(ed)s.

Later on, they acquired the Rufatti ... in the interim between the Wicks removal and the Rufatti installation, they used an Allen digital for almost 3 years.

Btw, I didn't get the job at Schuller's ... I was only 17 and only had 5 years under my belt in experience. Went instead to my home church (Lutheran) and secured a post there playing on a 5 rk Wicks, horseshoe console, wild trems, everything but the traps!!

Back to topic though:
I heard another story on the Atlantic City organ ... that during a renovation of another part of the building, some innocent worker came across a giant umbilical cord full of wires ... since it was in his way, he chopped it and removed it. It was supposedly one of the main wire bundles between the console and the chambers. Ouch ... :shake:

 

[Corno Dolce]

Aloha GrandMaster Krummhorn,

Oh - My - Goodness!!!!!!! Some sod cuts a trunk line that carries wires to the chambers??????? Yeah, how was he to know - But still, a question should have entered into his mind as to why there was such a heavy trunk cable in his way - Oh for crying out loud :shake::bawl::banghead::scold:

Aloha dll927,

And here I thought it was Leukemia that had claimed Peter Baicchi - A talented individual was he - Too bad that Sarcophagus J. Macabre claimed him way too early in his career.

 

[dll927]

Trust me, I was only speculating - it was surely leukemia. And I once thought that was a childhood ailment. Not so - I've known several adults who came down with it.

As for the Crystal Cathedral being tied up in Daddy: That is probably true of nearly all of the "televangelists" and megachurches. Going clear back to probably the original one - Oral Roberts - my take has always been that most of them are egomaniacs who have everything and everybody involved under their tight little thumbs. Nobody makes a move without permission from on high. And once that one individual is out of the way, things sort of fall apart. The demise of D. James Kennedy is a pretty good example, too. And I've heard more than once that "Papa" Schuller can be difficult to get along with.

You may also notice that almost without exception, nearly every such TV program has its money-grubbing sections. They love to beg for that item. Of course, they have to pay for the time, but I'll bet a few pockets expand, too. If you have ever been around the Crystal Cathedral "campus", there is a lot more than just the glass house - and it was all done on the backs of the little old ladies who send in $50 a month.

BTW, Schuller's daughter notwithstanding, there is another building with a rather large pipe organ in it - I think a four-decker.

 

[Corno Dolce]

Aloha dll927,

Now I must fully disclose - I have no *inside knowlege* of what caused Mr. Baicchi's demise - I simply don't know - It was a guesstimation on my part only. There is a whole host of maladies that he could have fallen victim to - My prayers go out to his family as they struggle to manage a life without their loved one.

God only knows that some of His disciples(Schuller, Roberts, Kennedy, Hinn, et al) can be more than a handful :shake::shake::shake: Alot of those ladies who sent $50/month believed in Schuller's message and loved his charisma. Of course, television ministry is very expensive. But now with *streaming broadcasts* over the net it all of a sudden becomes alot cheaper. The ladies sent their money freely as they are entitled to do. I am familiar with the Crystal Palace but not to the extent that our dear GrandMaster Krummhorn is.

Lets see here now - How to get back ON TOPIC :grin::grin::grin:

Well, there are those big ones in Europe like Passau Cathedral which has pipework put in other areas of the Cathedral - Wow, to get all of that sounding together in a relative state of tune :lol::lol::lol:

And then I think about my place of employ with a Walker Digital that has all the speakers, subwoofers included, firing downward from their lofty perch some 77 feet above the floor and how it *bathes* the room in *surround sound* - And if Washington National Cathedral ever gets the Casavant/Dobson machine installed at either end - It should be theoretically possible just to take the existing pipework and put half of it under the rose window and the other half at the other end of the Cathedral - Maybe that would give them *surround sound* at a fraction of the price of new instruments.......

My $1.3579 cents worth...

 

[Krummhorn]

. . . BTW, Schuller's daughter notwithstanding, there is another building with a rather large pipe organ in it - I think a four-decker.

Yes, that building is the "Arboretum" I mentioned above. It is also called the Frederick Swann Organ, possibly donated by him to the church.
The Aoelian Skinner is a IV/82 with 6 additional digital voices. It was built in 1951.

Swann was director of music and organist there for 16 years (1982-1998).

 

[dll927]

After he left, there was some static about him sort of "dissing" the main organ in the glass house. I'm not sure just what he had to say, but after he left he spent about three years at 1st Congregational.

By this point in time, Swann would be pushing 80, so he's no spring chicken any more. He supposedly retired from church work, but now lives out in the dessert someplace.

 

[Krummhorn]

Swann is 78 ... lives in Palm Desert, CA. More info here.

He will be one of the featured recital organists at the AGO Regional Convention in Phoenix (AZ) in June this year.

 

[tjndb]

Same added notes:

I read the other day that Peter Baicchi, once the associate organist at the Crystal Cathedral, died last year at the age of 38. Rather curious. Could he have been the same type as Lloyd Holzgraf, the long-time organist at First Congregational, who was known for liking the guys?

As a very close friend of Peter there is nothing curious about his untimely death. Peter developed a brain lesion that was inoperable. It took his life after becoming progressively worse. The rest of your question doesn't dignify a response.