Need Organ Notation Interpreted

I am creating a MIDI file of the attached piece. I need help interpreting some things. This is pretty basic stuff for a seasoned organist but I am not clear on which notes are played on which manuals and pedals. Please help!

At the beginning, I think the treble clef notes are on the choir while the bass clef notes are on the swell. Is this correct? In the third full measure, I think the bottom notes are played on the pedals. Where does this end? In measure 8? On the third beat of measure 8, "Sw." is between the staves. Does this mean both treble and bass clef notes are now played on the swell? Or is the pedal still used until measure 13 when it says "Man."? If so, do all notes get played on the choir for the next 4 measures? Then do all notes switch to the swell or does the pedal return for the lowest notes?

In the first measure of page 4, it says "Ch. + Sw." between the staves and "Ped." below the bass clef staff. Is this the designation for coupling or does it mean something else? What happens at the Poco animato near the end of Page 4? It says "Gt." there. Are all notes played on the great there or is the pedal still used for the lowest notes? Then on Page 5, the lower staff says "Sw." and the upper "Ch." It seems that if these indications are all referring to the manuals the pedals are only occasionally used, but that does not seem right to me, either.

I hope someone will take the time to tell me how an organist would play this piece. Once I know which notes are on which manuals and pedals, I can very quickly create a MIDI file. But on the organ I use, there is a different MIDI channel for each manual and the pedals, as well as other channels that control the stops and other settings. So I have to determine these things to create the file correctly.

Thanks in advance to those who are willing to assist!

I have accompanied this anthem many times during my years on the bench. I do not have the luxury of 3 manuals and certainly don't have a "soft 8' reed" to pull with the strings, and at that I have no real strings, either, only a Gemshorn.

So, I have to make do with what resources I have available. Here's how I register this particular anthem, and the first thing I do is throw out all the 'suggested' registrations and manual couplings and manual designations ... organists can do that ... those registrations are only a suggestion, not gospel.

Swell: 8' Spitzflote, 8' Gemshorn, 8' Gemshorn Celeste
Great: 8' & 4' Gedeckt, Sw to Gt Coupler
Pedal: 16' Bourdon, 8' Gedeckt, 4' Spitzflote

I begin the anthem on the swell ... using the shades very judicially. Basically whenever the women are singing, I use the Swell manual ... for the men, the Great manual, and throw the pedal in with the male voices and tacet the pedal with the female voices. On page 3 where the women re-enter, I cancel the Celeste stop and add the Swell 4' Flute and close the box ... at the top of page four, I return to the Great and bring on the 8' Principal via the Crescendo shoe (I have but 4 generals (reserved for hymns and liturgy) and no divisional pistons, so all stop adds or deletions are by hand and/or using the Crescendo shoe. At the decrescendo of page 4, I back off the Crescendo shoe and stay on the Great.

At the Poco Animato on page four, I remain on the great, and employ 8' & 4' Principals via the Crescendo shoe. On page 5 at the word "restore", I go back to the Swell and add the 2' flute stop and at the "f" at the bottom return back to the Great manual.

On page 6, at the beginning of the poco a poco cresc, I close the Swell box, and keep adding stops via the Crescendo shoe until the reeds kick in on the word "thy". Going to page 7, I back off the reed and stay on the Great, closing the Crescendo shoe until the word "ways", when I close it completely. For the Piu Lento, I return to the Swell and remove the 2' flute and adjust the Swell box to the voices.

As you can see, I make very effective use of the Crescendo shoe ... it takes lots of time to get used to, but it's one of those "tools" organists seldom use, but used well, it can really compliment your musical offerings. Now, I've been playing this particular instrument since 1982, so I am well acquainted where each and every stop adds or subtracts during the travel of that shoe.

Hi Lars,
You scored again.
How many times have we discussing those things.....
It is the inner meaning of the work that matters. If the performer understands that, then he/she can do the appropriate registrations to be in harmony with the meaning. EVEN ON A ONE MANUAL ORGAN. Score registration notes are indeed suggestions or as I say "starting points".
And the crescendo pedal. This is one great weapon. You said about many times. It's kinda magic but needs too the.... practice thing we discuss elsewere.... he he

UCG, IMHO, you MUST try Lars' way as he describes above. This is a very HQ analysis by a seasoned and highly experienced performer, it's one of his posts I convert them to pdf and keep them as main reference.

Best
Panos

I will try to apply Krummhorn's suggestions. They explain what makes for aneffective performance (and how). I am not performing it but creating anaccompaniment to be be driven by MIDI on acomputer.

When I was asked to accompany this piece I suggested using the organ, ratherthan piano, because it is well-suited to the instrument and so far none of themusic (except for hymns) done at our services since we moved into a church thathas an organ has utilized it. There is still some sensitivity to this, whichprobably doesn't make sense to people who are accustomed to hearing organ atchurch all the time, but it is the reality I face.

At any rate, I approached the first "rehearsal" by attempting tofollow the piece's directions and it became quickly apparent that I am am notproficient enough at interpreting such instructions yet to execute them in anactual performance, nor am I ready to accompany using pedals yet. So it wassuggested that I either go back to piano or pre-record it for organ. I chosethe latter because I need to know how to create an effective organ accompanmentwith MIDI.

So I still have a few questions. First, if I did not have the benefit ofsomeone like Lars explaining what an organist really does with a piece likethis, and tried to follow the directions correctly, how would I interpret them?I guess I'm simply asking my original questions, just for the sake of knowingwhat to do when confronted with this in the future.

Second, if the crescendo pedal is unrealistic for pre-recording (because Idon't know what MIDI messages are needed orwhat the effect will be), what stops are actually added when the shoe isdepressed? I can do stop control with MIDI butonly if I know in advance what stops are involved.

If you're willing to take the time to just look at the piece's directionsand tell me what they mean -- not what you would differently -- that would helpme a lot. It would give me an understanding of the composer's intentions andhelp me sort out what is supposed to be done on each manual and the pedals.

Again, thanks for the great explanation. It is very much appreciated!

Randy
(UCG Musician)

Hi Randy,

What makes a good Midi file stand out from other midi files ?
Technical issues? NO !
One must perform the piece on a midi recorder to make the difference !

If you just try to make a "robot" perform the piece, even with Lars' excellent advice, the result will not be pleasing, it will be accurate, yes, on tempo yes, but not pleasing....
It was something I have learn from Art Ensemble of Chicago : "the inner endless rythm". Each human has his own inner rythm, so performing music follows this inner unique rythm. When other people come close with this they perform as a group, having a stating point where all play at the same time then during the piece play they come to this point many times but after each one has gone his/her own circle of timing. Playin' live with Don Moye was a hell of experience for me on this matter....

So this way we can have lots of midi files for the same piece of work, each one incorporating the performers approach on the piece.
I prefere that than having a general midi file showing how the work sounds.

Now, experiment a little ! I mean try starting with the swell , change stops, add ect till you find what combination speaks to your heart.
Then this is what you'll use ! no matter what other experts or not would say. Of course there are some kinda standards you cannot avoid, like never use a heavy reed stop for smooth chord progression which needs soft 8 stops. But then again this you must try to be convinced that it's right !

I have seen Messianen improvising with just the mixture stops on all divisions !!!! But this was his work, cannot use those solo mixtures on Bach !

Anything you'll come up to, will be Randy's own version of the work. This is great.

Best
Panos

I found a book by Truette to be useful in understanding the registration indications in organ music. The whole book is interesting reading, but Chapter IX starting on page 104 is what you need.
http://ia331321.us.archive.org/2/items/organregistratio005719mbp/organregistratio005719mbp.pdf


Pete

and see page 81 about the crescendo.

Pete

Thank you

Thank you, el_supremo. I downloaded the book and it does explain the terminology and meaning of a composer's indications.

Thank you, Ghekorg7. As a musician, I fully understand what you are saying and I concur wholeheatedly. Unfortunately, I am dealing with an older instrument from a MIDI perspective and cannot record some of the settings. Also, I only have access to the instrument on the day we have services there. So most of what I must do has to be done at home using a computer and I am unable to hear what it sounds like until after the fact.

Thanks again, Krummhorn. Your insight is always very valuable. I will apply your suggestions to the MIDI sequence as best I can, now armed with an idea of what stops are added when using the crescendo shoe.

UCG Musician said:

. . . Thanks again, Krummhorn. Your insight is always very valuable. I will apply your suggestions to the MIDI sequence as best I can, now armed with an idea of what stops are added when using the crescendo shoe.

Click to expand...

You are welcome, Randy.

As others have stated, experimentation is the key - it's what sounds right to you.
Most crescendo shoes add stops from soft to loud ... Foundations (flutes, principals of 8' pitch, then 4' pitch and then 2', and from there either reeds and/or mixtures. I should have clarified that in my previous post.

There is no law saying that an organist has to slavishly follow what the music page says about which manual to use. That's what the publisher, or some editor, suggests. Since organs are all different in what stops they have (or don't have!!), the organist has to use his/her head a bit.

As for not much use of the pedals, try Franck's Choral No. 1 in E. It goes nearly half-way through before the pedals are even heard from. Since you seem to be talking about choral music, that is often a different animal, given that most organ music has the pedals on a separate staff. But generally, you are correct in assuming that the 'lowest' notes go on the pedals. It's just that lot of music is written without organists in mind.

It would be nice if the publishers of church choral music were required to put out a separate accompanist's version for the organist, but we should all live so long.