Technical advice

[jvhldb]

I guess this question has been asked and answered before.

With the season changes our pipe oran in church is starting to go "wacky", cyphers on a daily basis, pipes so out of tune that it seems like they belong in anothe rank of their own, pipes with the wind blowing through them like a storm, but no sound being produced.

On the trumpet alone 8 pipes went dead this week, our gues is dust. In the maintenance log the techy made a note in Nov'07, "A lot of dust was found in the trumpets, will need cleaning out, other pipes also found to be effected by dust." how and when this dust is supposed to be removed was nog indicated. Maybe he expected a mirracle to occur, seing that it is a church organ.

As no mirracle happend so far and we have to wait until November for a techy to visit us again, is there any way we can remove the dust ourselves without doing an apprentice ship as organ builders?

 

[Krummhorn]

Ho Johan,

I think what the tech may be referring to is "washing" the pipes. This is a very tedious job and has to be done with a special liquid solution - one that doesn't harm the metals or leave any residue on or inside the pipes. I haven't the foggiest what that solution is - perhaps someone else here does and will chime in.

Although I believe in miracles, they always seem not to happen with pipe organs. I'm wondering how so much dust is allowed to get into the chambers to cause these dead notes and ciphers.

Weather changes will affect tuning ... in my own parish, where we control the temperature all year long, the season changes have great effect. Since we have just converted over from heating to cooling, I am rapidly approaching "calliope" status myself and anxiously waiting for my semi-annual spring tuning. My flues have headed south and my reeds are going sharp ... yes, sharp! Explanation: As the air in the chest warms up, it causes friction, which causes heat - heat naturally compresses air and causes the wind pressure inside the chest to increase, higher wind pressure in turn "overblows" the pipes, which results in the tone going sharper in pitch.

I'm assuming the pipes with the "wind blowing through them like a storm" are the reed rank(s)? If that be the case, chances are that dirt has entered into the lower part of those pipes where the brass reed is located. Getting dirt out of there is going to be tricky ... as it requires the removal of the pipe from the chest, then removing the lower boot (exposing the reed) and with great care, removing the offending dust and/or dirt.

It's all I can think of at the moment ... will try to revisit this thread later in the day.

 

[Corno Dolce]

I'm wondering if not some gauze mounted in a frame thats dimensioned with the intake duct of the blower in mind might help to keep dust from getting inside the reservoir, windtrunks, windchest and pipes.

 

[AllanP]

One trick the organ repair person has shown me is to remove the pipe, remove the boot exposing the reed, and using a CLEAN dollar bill to clean the space between the reed and the shallot. A very small particle of dirt will cause a trumpet to rattle, a larger amount of dirt will possibly cause it to not sound at all. However, that much dirt coming from either the air in the chamber or from the blower should not be allowed in a pipe organ. I have a air filter on the blower intake which takes air from the house and keep the chamber closed when the organ is not being used (shutters closed) to minimize the effects of dirt.

 

[jvhldb]

Thanks for all the tips. It sounds like there isn't a lot we will be able to do on our own. I also found out today that im TO FAT to fit throught the access pannels. Apparently the dust is sifting through from the ceiling (about 38 years worth of dust has to go somewhere). I phoned the organist about the air filter, she said she will recommend it to the board on Monday. Unfortuanetly we don't have shutters on the air chamber, it sucks air fdirectly from inside the organ. We can't even keep the swell shutters closed to minimize dust on the reeds, they open automatically when the power is turned off.

Anything we should know about removing the boot? I don't want to upset the tuning of the few pipes still in tune, as for the rest the tuning is so out some of them sound like they belong to a different octave in another rank.

 

[Krummhorn]

Hi Johan,

Don't feel bad ... I'm too tall (6'5") and too fat to crawl about such chambers.

In the image below, is a cutaway drawing of a reed pipe and a flue pipe.

The boot fits rather snuggly (so that no air escapes) to the resonator ... one needs to hold the pipe by the collar directly above the boot and gently wiggle the boot back and forth during removal. Holding the pipe above that point (the resonator itself) may cause damage to the pipe itself and would then require re-soldering (can't use a normal electronics soldering iron) by someone qualified/knowledgeable to do so.

A lot of pipework contains lead ... lead is one of the softer metals ... and it doesn't take much to deform lead/tin pipes, so the handling of these must be minimal and all movement must be carefully coordinated.

I echo AllanP's suggestion of the clean paper money used to clear out dust particles between the reed and the shallot.

Once the boot has been replaced, and the pipe is mounted onto the windchest, you can tune it by gently moving the tuning wire (slider) in one direction or the other (lowering will raise pitch, raising the slider will lower the pitch. Just use an ordinary table knife to tap this slider up or down - don't use your fingers - tune it to the 4' Principal so you can hear the beats easier.

The reed pipes that continue to play, I'd leave alone - you could do a little touch up tuning as long as that doesn't violate any whatever agreement the church has with the normal tuner/repair tech. There is a general rule around pipe organs ... "let sleeping dust lie" ... If it isn't causing any problems, leave it rest ... stirring up more troubles right not is only going to aggravate the situation.

 

[Contratrombone64]

Tall and fat?? I resemble that remark!

 

[Corno Dolce]

And I am a portly 5'11" at 100 kgs.

 

[jvhldb]

Hi Johan,

... stirring up more troubles right not is only going to aggravate the situation.

Thanks for the clear advice, now all I have to do is get enough clean bills and I my Saturday will be booked.

 

[jvhldb]

I got the shock of my life today. I sat down at the organ as usual, pulled up a fairly strong registration to practice some end of service music, and got blasted from the organ bench..

We don't know if know whether our dire predictions of the organ dying during a service or something else, but somebody convinced the organ tuner to visit us six months before his scheduled service. I don't know what he did, but usually we use most of the ranks, even during practice, just to be heard above the creaking of the roof beams. Today I had to close the swell shutters even when I only dialed up a 4' pipe. The organ is now so in tune that it actually sounds like I'm playing the wrong notes (I'm to used to the false notes I guess).

So mirracles do happen to church organs.

 

[Krummhorn]

That's great news, Johan ...

It's wonderful too that the organ tech could be called in and had the time opening to handle the service call.

Yes, "in tune" organs are like that - they seem to play all the wrong notes :lol:

 

[jvhldb]

I had another surprise today. The organ tuner was supposed to make a visit yesterday. Our organist was out of town and asked me to leave a note for the tuner to fix the tremulant and to find out what can be done about the dust and bat sh... in the organ.

This morning when I went to practice I found he left a note in the organ diary, stating that the tremulant was fixed and that the organ is only cleaned every 10-15 years. I neerly had a heart attack, when is the next 10-15 year cycle over? I can picture myself squizing between the pipes every Saturday afternoon, upending the dead ones to get rid of the bat crap for the next 14 years!!!

I think I'm going to vest in an industrial leave blower or giant vacuum cleaner.:grin::grin:

 

[Corno Dolce]

Aloha Johan,

Whilst pondering the implications of bat treacle in the pipes I do recall someone mentioning that one could affix some gauze across the top of the pipes - of course whilst being extremely careful not to knock down or up any tuning collars, slits, or scrolls near the top of the pipe.

Just a thought...

 

[FinnViking]

Here where I live it is normal that the organ builders wash the pipes every 10-15 years with normal tap water. It doesn't harm tin/lead and leaves an unsignificant amount of minerals when it dries. The front pipes are immediately dried as to avoid any stains. Organ pipes tolerate normal careful handling, they are sensitive but not that fragile.

The swell shutters that open when the organ is turned off can also be reversed, i.e. to shut when the power is off. Just flip a couple of cables in their powering box.

 

[jhnbrbr]

AS an organist, it's amazing what you have to do to keep your instrment working. I used to play the organ at a fairly remote country church which wasn't entirely bird-proof. There were tiimes when I went for a practice and found a live bird trapped in one of the open diapason (display) pipes. I discovered I could stand on the stool and lift the pipe off quite easily, carry it oustide the church, tip the grateful bird out onto the ground, and then put the pipe back in and continue playing.

 

[jvhldb]

Aaaaa!, many thanks for the idea Corno. One of the local auto shops sell a fine weave "sound transparent" cloth that the auto junkies use to cover the speakers and boom boxes in their cars, that might also serve to keep out the dust as well as the fertiliser.

As to having the swell shutters close when the power is turned of, we looked at the possibility, but the swell shutters are held open by a spring, the close when a 3 stage bellows is inflated so no power + no wind to inflate=open shutters. And then we found out that inside the organ case the ceiling is so far from the wall that a swarm of batts can do aerial manouvers between the ceiling and wall (no builder or handyman is prepared to TRY and close the gap with the pipes in position).

Fortuanetly I haven't found any birds in the pipes yet (fortuanetly their to small for that).

 

[JONESEY]

jhnbrbr, that's a great story!.
I myself found just how little I know about the 'workings' of the Pipe Organ last week (see my post!).
We too are waiting the organ tuner / fixer to come out - tomorrow I'm told.

Fingers crossed he can fix the problem - I'm hoping now for one of those miracles that happened to Johan.